“I think at the end of the day, there’s a lot of really good humans out there that are misinformed, misguided, whatever the thing may be. And I think part of our job is to show up with that authentic care.” — Oana Amaria
Show Summary
In this episode of Stories From the Field, Firefly’s leadership team (Oana Amaria, Jason Rebello, and Felicia Scott) come together to process the many turbulent changes, consequences, and future impact from the current administration in 2025. They share their personal insights on topics ranging from companies abandoning their DEI (diversity, equity, and inclusion) initiatives, the cultural impact of Kendrick Lamar’s Super Bowl halftime show, and the clear social and political divide among Americans. If crisis is a test, how do you prepare your organization to pass with integrity? And ultimately, how do we rise to the challenge of the moment with integrity and compassion?
Join us in our ongoing dialogue on centering human dignity in values-driven leadership and daily conversations.
Learning Highlights From This Episode:
- The Firefly team analyzes the cultural impact and symbolism of Kendrick Lamar’s Super Bowl halftime show, especially in the current social and political climates.
- There’s a rising “crisis of integrity” in leadership where companies are revealing the true nature (performative or authentic) of their DEI initiatives.
- Strategies for remaining compassionate despite the differences in our core beliefs.
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About Firefly Inclusion Solutions
Firefly Inclusion Solutions is a values-driven organizational development firm that collaborates with leaders to transform themselves and their teams, paving the way for more diverse, equitable, and inclusive companies, products, and experiences.
Full Transcript
Oana Amaria: I am super excited to do this new format for our guests that have not heard us in a while. You know we will still definitely bring in guests and the usual setup that we’ve had in previous episodes. But we also thought it’d be great for you to really get to know us as human beings, as practitioners. We’re also hella funny when we’re together, the three of us. So why not? Why not include that as a part of our conversation. So real quick, Oana Amaria, founder and practice leader at Firefly, and I’ll pop it over to you all.
Felicia Scott: Hi everyone, I’m Felicia Scott. I’m a managing partner at Firefly. I haven’t done too many podcasts before, so some of you who do watch them might even be thinking, “There’s a third person at Firefly?” Yes, I do. I exist, I live, and breathe. Kind of like Charlie from, what’s that show? Charlie’s Angels? Yeah, I really do exist. Not just the voice, I’m here. So, hey everybody, looking forward to our time and conversation. Jason!
Jason Rebello: I’m still laughing at the Charlie’s Angels. I’m not sure what that makes me in this scenario, but we’ll save that for another podcast. My name is Jason Rebello, I am one of the other managing partners with Firefly Inclusion. Excited about the opportunity to have this sincere, honest conversation with two people that, you know, I enjoy having these types of dialogues with anyway; and excited to be able to bring some of that rawness, realness to those that follow us and are interested in our perspective on all things happening right now.
Oana Amaria: Yeah, as you both know, we kind of put together a list of all the things I want to talk about. Obviously, we’re not going to get into all of that. But I will say I was on Instagram last night instead of going to bed, as I should have been scrolling. And I saw one of our good friends post and the comment was, and I just want to add it, is “While others mess around just trying to chase the check, Kendrick got the check and the checkmate.” and I thought that was just so powerful. And I know that the whole world right now is talking about the Super Bowl, but I wanted to kind of throw it out there to each of you. I personally felt like it like picked me off the floor and gave me a whole lot of courage. But for our listeners that maybe didn’t get all the symbolism and all the things like what, give me your hot takes on the Super Bowl.
Felicia Scott: I’m gonna jump in. Now, I might be the only person in the world by now who hasn’t watched, didn’t watch the Super Bowl. I haven’t seen all the halftime performances. I saw little clips here and there. Serena doing the Crip Walk. But I’ll tell you what does stand out to me. What stands out to me is, so you read and you hear, it was the worst ever, it was the best ever. Some people still think it was about Drake. It was not about Drake at all. And I think what has stood out to me is how some groups feel as if they have the right to validate or invalidate someone else’s culture. I think that’s the thing. There’s some actor who went on a whole rant about rap music and what it does or doesn’t represent for the kids, et cetera. And I think that’s been the most interesting piece is feeling like you have the right to validate or invalidate someone else’s culture is really what stands out to me.
Jason Rebello: For me, I’m gonna take a slightly different angle. I did watch the Super Bowl. It’s a horrible game for anybody, regardless of who you’re interested in winning. It was kind of done right out—
Oana Amaria: Boring. Not horrible. Boring. Yeah.
Jason Rebello: Yes, yes. But one of the things that kind of came up for me in watching the halftime show, but also hearing all of the dialogue back and forth…Where I landed was really this reflection of Black culture as one of the most influential forces shaping the world economically, socially, artistically, and being historically grounded in resilience, creativity, and transformation. So for me, it was really about what does it mean for groups to really wake up and recognize the influence, the power—whether it’s financial power, whether it’s cultural power, all those different dynamics—those are some of the questions that were really coming up for me. Cause I think as we move forward in this new administration that is strip away anything that even resembles support for underestimated, underrepresented groups or those that are not in the highest levels of privilege…Given that that’s the reality and all the important pushback that’s going to occur, you know, with whatever levers that there are available to those that want to push back. I think there’s an underlying question of, you know, what do we do with the cultural and financial power that we have? How do we, you know, collaborate? How do we allow it to bring groups together to figure out, regardless of what is happening? We have the means, the ability, the financial, the cultural, the political power to, as many of us say, you know, build your own table. What does that look like in our local communities? What does that look like in our neighborhoods? What does that look like within, you know, the social capital that each and every one of us has? What does it mean to kind of come together and rethink how do we want to use or wield that type of power for the, you know, in the ways that are value-aligned to what I think a lot of, certainly the three of us feel and many others. I think that to me was at the crux of what came out of that conversation. How do we actualize and galvanize our political and financial power to back the values that we have as individuals and collectively as a community?
Oana Amaria: I think that’s actually quite incredible. You know, we recently posted about values-driven leadership. So Jay, we’ll come back to that in a minute cause I think that’s a really important piece. For me personally, as a person that I always joke like the Lane Tech girl came out in me with that halftime show, just because of like the generation and the type of music I grew up with. But like really what it meant to me was, wow, like he stood up for all of us in a way, whether or not people are gonna sit there and invalidate him because they don’t understand. And the fact that he had the courage to do that just was like quite incredible. And I just think about how many time, this of us in sessions, right? When someone’s really being a contrarian or whatever, questioning, pick a thing—and how hard that is. And he showed up and didn’t miss a step, literally didn’t miss a step in his performance. I mean, we’ve all watched our fair share of like terrible halftime shows, right? And that one was like super solid. I know you didn’t see it Felicia, but it was like the layers, the nuance, the words, the different, you know, pieces to it that made the whole visualizations, right? And it was pretty incredible to have like a sitting president who is sitting there telling you that you don’t deserve to be seen and you don’t deserve to be heard and all the things, right? And actively deconstructing our democracy. And to have him show up and say “Right time, wrong one,” you know? It just, gosh…like we need that energy in our fight in this industry, in our fight for equity in the workplace, and I was pretty down the past few weeks. I was like, I found myself having a hard time shaking it because I just felt defeated. And I, to me, what he did, like, picked me up off the floor. And I wasn’t his audience. I don’t need to be his audience because, like I’m a human being that is connecting with that message. And I think that’s the point, right?
Felicia Scott: Well what you’re saying, I think that’s—you are his audience. His audience is anyone interested in the current conversation or the fight for equity, et cetera. So I think you are exactly his target audience with the messaging.
Oana Amaria: So I think this is like a good segue into all the stuff that’s going down. I mean, like it’s lightning speed headlines of pick an agency that’s being deconstructed. We can talk about just what’s happening and impacting our work and our industry. But I’d love to really think about the conversation you and I, Jason, had was this idea of a crisis of integrity.
Jason Rebello: Yeah. Yeah. I think when I think about that, it’s you know, we’re at a point where every leader is having to figure out, you know, did the values and the mission, you know, that’s written on our website and in our handbooks—does it actually mean anything? Is it just performative? And I think for many, it is performative. And I think the problem for many companies and the reason why it’s performative is because it was a response. It’s this constant response to whatever is trending, whatever the energy is trending, whether you know, George Floyd gets murdered now, you know, everybody’s looking to some kind of response. We’re going to do the thing, whether or not we believe in it, whether or not we understand it, whether or not we’re going to do it in a way that actually kind of penetrates our organization, or whether or not it’s just we have to “fill in the blank” in order to be in line. And now with the wind shifting the other way, you see the exact same companies, many of them doing the same thing with whatever is the latest trend. “We don’t need diversity, equity, inclusion. It’s a waste of time.” I look at things like Meta and they’re kind of flip-flopping back and forth. So for me, both as a consumer and somebody that, you know, talks with people that are trying to figure out, you know, where they want to put their genius, their knowledge, their skills, and abilities to work, you know, wanting to work in places that have real integrity, wanting to work in places that view human dignity as a starting point, not just as an ethos, but also in the products and services they create, that they want to create positive value or good beyond just their short-term stock options or short-term stockholder meetings and value. What does it mean? Is it our business set up to allow our individual team members to thrive? And does it also help society as a large, thrive? In the way that we show up and the way that we do things and the way that we treat human beings—or is it just part of our marketing? And if DEI—or diversity, equity, inclusion—or human dignity, or trying to have a high-trust, non-toxic work culture is just a marketing campaign for you, then I think the writing is on the wall for everybody to take a look and see. And the reason why I brought up, you know, the Black culture as this kind of defining entity, it’s you know—I think the last thing I read was something like $1.6 trillion in buying power. That’s like an incredible amount of energy, power, capital that is backed by not this monolithic set of values, but I think it’s worth having a conversation around what are the types of companies that people want to go work for? What are the types of companies that people want to buy from and utilize their services? The question I keep coming back to is, if the almighty dollar is the most important voting tool, what type of world do we want to create with where and how we utilize our capital? What are the companies that we support? Are they interested in actually creating good within our communities or is it an extractive, exploitive model that they’re operating from? And I think those are some serious questions that we need to start asking. Because if we start asking those questions, for me, I’m always looking to not for these large behemoth companies to automatically all of a sudden transform. I’m actually even more interested in the next generation of founders that are looking at the realities of the companies and say, “This isn’t working. I want to build something that is truly values-aligned. I want to build something where people that have the same values can truly come to work and we can create positive sum within the communities that we’re interested in supporting.” I think that’s…I don’t know, that’s what I just keep coming back to as it relates to integrity. And you can see the lack thereof with the way companies are showing up and leaders are kind of pulling out.
Oana Amaria: You know, as I hear you say that, it makes me think of like the Pride sprinkles or like Felicia, what was that? Hellman’s gross sandwich example, right? Where they were trying to show up for Pride Month. And what it gets at is this idea of like authentically connecting and to kind of pull the thread back to Kendrick Lamar. He had, I saw this interview with this little boy that asked about authenticity. And he talked about how like people can feel you when you’re real. And if we can all get in the practice of showing up authentically, the result is like love and connection and empathy and all the things that make us good humans, let alone good leaders. And I thought that was really important because what we’re saying, and I saw for example, like there’s Goldman Sachs now stepping back and they were like barely—banking is not known for their DEI efforts, right? And they were just like barely making a dent and now they’re not making requirements on, you know, women or underrepresented communities on boards. And I just want to remind people that—and we talk about this all the time—but it’s going to cost you money. Like, you know, you want to hate on all these initiatives, but like the numbers don’t lie, right? And to Jason’s point, people are gonna, you know, we saw it with Costco and Target and how people are like, “Forget this, I’m not gonna go spend my money there anymore” and “I will get intentional and creative about where I go do that and where I go shopping.” We also know from the research that unhappiness at work is expensive, right? We know that trust results in higher productivity. We know that values-alignment is better than money. I mean, like this is not stuff that magically goes away because you decided that it’s more business savvy to say you need a masculine culture, right? Whatever that means. And so I think they’re, unfortunately for us within this industry, the impact has to hit and it’s going to hit all of us in the meantime. But I think in the end, people will understand the value-add to the conversations and to this human-centered approach to building dignity in the context of purpose and innovation.
Felicia Scott: You know, I think that this isn’t any other thing. And I think there was one way we could talk about this in 2023, 2024, but there’s a whole new way to talk about this in 2025 after January 20th. And that is there is an element of fear that is present. And the element of fear is not just on a backlash level from your consumers. The fear is government involvement and where the government stands with this. And I think that’s a whole new layer that we can’t afford to miss, we can’t afford to not talk about. I mean, you have Costco, yes, making their stand. But then you also have Costco getting a letter from 24 state attorney generals, you know, saying nicely, but not so nicely, like “Hey, you know, we recommend you stop.” So I think, you know, that’s a level that has to be talked about and a level that really has to be understood. And for me, just before we jumped on this call, I was talking to my sister and she actually talked about the demonization of the term DEI: diversity, equity, and inclusion. But, I grew up—and you know my brother posted this on Facebook this morning—and the pledge of allegiance that I had to do every morning as a kid, it ended with “liberty and justice for all.” And that’s all diversity, equity, and inclusion is. It is liberty and justice for all. And I think where the fear is and where people don’t know what to do is it seems as if we’re dealing with an administration that—what we’re trying to prize and value—it’s becoming maybe a little bit scary to stand by that. When you have organizations with DEI watch lists, posting personal information, salaries, locations, it’s a scarier time, not just from that economic bottom line, but from feeling, will there be retribution? You know, am I safe? And I think that’s part of the conversation that we’re now grappling with is that this is the same old, but it’s slightly different. And we’re kind of almost back to—the emotional sense of it—is kind of almost back to, in my opinion, like the ‘60s, you know? And what I’ve often wondered is in the ‘60s when people were marching and getting arrested, people were putting second mortgages on their homes—at least in the Black community—putting second mortgages on their homes for strangers in jail. And I don’t, you know, I don’t know if we’re built like that right now cause I think we’re very much centered on how things impact us. I don’t know if we can make that commitment to do that. I mean, not trying to be smart at the mouth, but like, when Kaepernick took the knee, people wouldn’t even stop watching football. So where are we really and what is really required of all of us to get through this difficult time?
Oana Amaria: You know, I don’t know if we have the answer to that, but I do have a feeling that this environment is gonna help us figure that out, right? Like, I don’t think we’re gonna have a choice on how that shows up for each of us.
Jason Rebello: As I’m reflecting, Felicia at least on what you said, yeah no, I don’t think we’re there. But I also think that we’re just at the beginning of—and this is the other point I wanted to make—there is like all the anti-DEI rhetoric and actions. I think people are generally confused at who gets hurt the most as these things happen. And that is, it’s not funny, but when I look back and I’m looking at the dismantling of this, that, and the other, we as professionals in the space know who are the beneficiaries of many of these different types of actions and programs. And it’s not people that look like Felicia. It’s not people that look like me.
Oana Amaria: People that look like me. Literally like me, Like, middle of the bell, like me.
Jason Rebello: So as we’re in this period of demonizing this and we’re going to remove anything that has these three letters involved in it, that’s all well and good. But the reality is it’s impacting a broad swath of Americans that are going to be negatively impacted either directly or indirectly just by you know, people no longer being in positions to be able to serve, or advocate, or support creating environments where people can show up and not have to deal with microaggressions or not have to deal with toxic behavior. That’s the core of what I love about the work that we do the most is really about trying to help organizations figure out how to clean up just shitty, toxic work culture, right? Regardless of who you have in there, whether it’s, you know, the idea that there is only one way to be and that you need to show up and spend 80% of your life working to enrich people that don’t care about the local communities, the neighborhoods, the towns—rural, urban—they don’t care about any of that. And that you should just be grateful that you have a job and show up is just so backwards and antiquated that again, as this continues to play out, I really feel that there is going to be a wake up call for everybody. It’s not just underestimated or underrepresented communities that are all—it’s really everybody. So I think this idea of like, what do you really stand for? Once the boogeyman is taken away and you realize that a lot of this is really just to be able to enrich the people that are already wealthy, the top 1%, and that the people that many of us have elected don’t really care about the majority of people’s situations. I think once Americans in particular wake up to that reality, because I think that reality—a lot of people in other parts of the world are aware of that reality—but once Americans wake up to that reality, it’ll be an opportunity for us to say, “Does this system really work for all?” For all, right? And now that it’s clear that it doesn’t and the systems and the infrastructure are breaking down, what, you know, for me, I look at it as an opportunity of what do we want to rebuild now that the, you know, the curtain has been pulled back? Everybody can see kind of the reality and there hopefully will be an opportunity to kind of rebuild. I also think that there’s…I am not in favor of massive tax dollar waste. I am not in favor of, you know, my resources going towards waging war all over the world. I’m not for any of those things, right? I’m not for a DOD or a Pentagon that couldn’t pass an audit for the last 20 years and then failed the last five. Like I’m not for any of those things, but I’m also not for blowing up the very infrastructure that, you know, that allows us as human beings to be accountable and support those that are less fortunate. And I think that’s what I’m seeing happening left and right, which is, again, it’s sad to see it play out. And knowing that people still haven’t really woken up to this reality yet, but they will. But they will.
Oana Amaria: I feel like you’re going to jump in.
Felicia Scott: No, it’s just so many things that cross my mind, the headlines. Like, I think her name is Lauren Boebert made a post: “Am I the only one who needs subtitles to understand what Kendrick Lamar is saying?” And then somebody responded, “Who’s going to tell her that’s DEI?” Having the accessibility, and that’s what this is about. Just what you’re saying, you need to understand, there are people who really needed to understand and DEI brought that to the forefront and people responded to it. And so like people really don’t necessarily understand and see how many ways of just stopping to saying, “Hey, here’s my story in life and here’s how I move and live.” And then having the curiosity to wonder, “Oana, how do you move and live? Jason, how do you move and live?” And then realizing, “Oh, that’s different.” And like, what can we do about that? Why is that? And what can we do about it? That’s all it really is. But again, it’s been something that’s been demonized. And then I’m reading yesterday some senators suing Starbucks because DEI slowed down people getting their coffee and their, what is that, pastry? Like come on like what are we actually doing here?
Oana Amaria: The one thing I would love to just say over and over and over is this has nothing to do with efficiency. This is a cash grab. This is about technodualism. This is about so many other things that have nothing to do with DEI. So yeah, we can do this intro course. Are you really against inclusion? Are you really against equity? In reality, I think the zoom-out moment for me is like, a lot of brokenness. Right? There’s a lot of self-centeredness in a world and in a universe where we’re interconnected. It’s never going to think about the people that even did like Econ 101, right? The macro and the micro and like how much debt we have, right? When we think about our debt in the world, like…forget Drake being Canadian. Like what happens when Canada’s pissed at us? What happens when there’s instability, right? Like what happens to your companies? So fine Google, you want to go ahead and change it to the Gule of America because you’re a bunch of shmucks? Like okay, you want to play that game? You can play that game, but at the end of the day it’s back to a bigger game that has nothing to do with any of us and we will all pay for it. And that game as they’re trying to get at the defense funds and war bolsters economies, right? And the people that are going to pay for it are our children and our communities, right? And so to me, it’s hard to remain in a place of compassion. And maybe this is like the place for us to kind of wrap up and think about, you know. When you read that these people in Trump’s sphere and the people that are influencing policy right now, like genuinely hate women, genuinely think that any woman that is in a place of power is a DEI hire and it’s not about competence…How do you remain compassionate when you dislike 51 point whatever percent of the population, right? And so I think that’s my question at large is, “How do we remain compassionate?” You know so much of our work is like not showing up with the blame and shame and not showing up with the I told you so’s about people Googling tariffs after the election. You know, how do we remain committed to the humanistic work that we do in the context of that brokenness that feels very overwhelming, you know?
Felicia Scott: Well, I’m gonna say what I think. And I remain that way because, you know, one day I’ll expire. Don’t know when that day will be. Everybody has a clock that runs out. And I need the world to be better than the one I was born into. This is, for me, this is not about me. This is about my nieces and nephews. It’s about my great nieces and nephews. It’s about your kids. It’s about Jason’s kids. This is what this is about. We have to do, we have to do better. And I can’t do better if I’m angry, and bitter, and hateful, and narrow-minded about even the differences. I can’t do that. And so for me, I don’t understand a lot of things, but I’m willing to try to understand. But what I’m not willing to do anymore is debate. So like, any negative comments: they’re not worthy of responding to. It’s about are we really trying to create a world that goes beyond our finite existence? Because if we are trying to do that, the science says certain things, you know, the social scientists say certain things. And if we’re really trying to be sustainable and have civilization beyond us, then we’re going to have to find a way to communicate and then really understand what it is to be a democracy. That’s part of the conversation. And I think it is also, Jason, you kind of alluded to it a bit before. But it really is about people understanding their economic power and understanding just how much you are needed for this world to be and to exist. And I think if we can begin to do those things on some grassroots levels, I think we have a chance. I really do.
Jason Rebello: You mentioned this word “interconnectedness” and I think that’s at the foundational level of a kind of mindset, like framework shift, that I don’t think most people are at, especially in the U.S., just given our overall isolated nature. But if you are operating in this world from a sense that all life is interconnected and that we are all interconnected, then your entire framework for view in the world and how to operate within it is grounded in that, versus this idea of we’re not interconnected. “We can have our own little island and thrive despite everybody else in the world suffering.” That is the framework that we are currently operating on. And I’m sorry, it’s not true. It leads to disaster in a more and more interconnected world where everybody else is looking around the table trying to figure out, you know, how do we collectively you know, collaborate, utilize resources, you know, figure out a way to build a bigger pie instead of figuring out constantly how to make sure that “us versus them” gets the majority of the pie and setting up policies and actions that are meant to continue that mindset or thinking. Versus we now have the collective ability, the technology, the resources to really create a whole different pie that is based off of not a scarcity mindset, right? Not in a zero sum mindset, but in one that is truly this positive sum regenerative that there is more to be created once we get ourselves aligned in this interconnected type of way. And I don’t know what is required for us to have this real shift towards that understanding. I don’t know how bad things need to get before we all wake up and say, “You know what, this isn’t working.” I am trying to do—along with the rest of us—trying to help people, especially those in leadership positions, figure out how to adjust before absolute tragedy and chaos hits. How do we future-proof our business knowing that we’re operating in a more interconnected world, knowing that we don’t want our business to have negative societal impacts, negative environmental impacts, negative impacts on the water that our children have to drink, or the air that they’re eventually going to have to breathe? These are just basic concepts of like, wow, yes, I want clean drinking water. I want my kids to be able to go outside and not be fearful of this, that, or the other happening. Or the environment is such that they can’t even walk outside and breathe clean air, which again is a reality in some other parts of the world, right? And so the fact that I see that happening in other places, I know that that is a reality that we are going to find ourselves in unless we, you know, wake up to the fact that we need to be operating in a more connected, interconnected way as human beings. But in order to do that, we have to value every human being irrespective of their culture, their particular way of practicing spirituality or faith, their particular desires for lifestyle, whatever it could be. Like if we can’t get past the othering of every human being that doesn’t exactly look and think like us, then it’s gonna be a challenging road ahead. But the faster, and for me, it’s looking at the next generation that is already operating in a slightly different paradigm that most people don’t even talk about. They’re already more aligned with this interconnected, you know, openness to difference in many different ways. And for my effort, I want to continue to help plant these seeds in their minds of how they want to be future leaders, as future business operators, as future educators, as future, you know, politicians, you know. What is the framework that you are grounded in, that you are creating policy from that you’re taking action from?
Oana Amaria: Yeah actually I think for me, as I think about that question, I think the skill set I rely on most is my parenting skill sets because I feel like what is my most generous interpretation of what’s happening with these human beings. Like when you think about—we all have kids in different seasons of life, but if I were to react to every toddler meltdown, what is that demonstrating? And I feel like that’s a really good mindset for me in these moments where I need to look beyond the behavior and whatever my interpretation or judgment is of that. And the thing that we talk about all the time is get to the heart of the essence of that fear or that unmet need and connecting with that humanity to say, “I think at the end of the day, there’s a lot of really good humans out there that are misinformed, misguided, whatever the thing may be.” And I think part of our job is to show up with that authentic care. Again, you can’t do that with plenty of people, you know, like the man that created a website that the whole world is talking about right now. Like I’m not interested in being empathetic with him or you know, there’s other examples of like the people we’re not going to debate with. But I think for the majority of human beings, my call to action for myself is really like, how do I connect with that human being at the essence of, you know, that unmet need that is creating all this chaos in the world, right? And I think that’s really hard. That’s really, really hard. It’s hard at work. It’s hard in life. And I think that’s just something that, you know, maybe we can try to figure out like how do we ground ourselves in that? And I don’t know if there’s anything else you would add that would be like a helpful tip to practitioners. I mean, we’re all like, this is like the heaviest couple of weeks in a long time, really maybe two years for us, right? And as we’re thinking about preparing for the season, what else would you add?
Jason Rebello: I think this idea around crisis and identity, right? If crisis is a test, “How do you prepare your organization to pass with integrity?” is the question that I want to leave for everyone. What does that really look like? What does that look like for leaders? What does that look like for team members? Because I think things haven’t even really fully started to break yet. As a result, I think a great quote that I was talking with somebody that was definitely more middle-of-the-road as far as their politics and is very aligned with some of the core ideas around corruption in politics and how do we move past it and waste and things like that. But their phrase was like, “I was hoping that they would do it with intentionality, with the scaffold, with precision, and they’re just like throwing sticks of dynamite left and right.” And there are real consequences to doing it that way, to literally blowing up the infrastructure of the largest global economy in the world. So like, I guess my point is that things haven’t even really started to break and we’re doing this to ourselves. Meanwhile, there’s a whole host of global challenges and issues that are going to further test our ability to withstand and continue to move forward in a positive direction. So I think, again, I think people that are just kind of sitting on the sidelines like “Well, it hasn’t touched me or it’s not really affected or, you know, that sucks for them,” you know, mentality that I think a lot of people have. This passive acceptance is dangerous and short-sighted, not understanding that this is going to have long-lasting impact on a lot of things that a lot of people really care about, and expect, and aren’t aware of, you know. What’s at risk as far as it’s like basic infrastructure, you know, for kids, for elderly, you know, all these different types of groups. So again, this question that I have in mind is “If crisis is a test, how do you prepare your organization, your company, your community, your family, right, to pass with integrity?” The conversations that are happening on CNN and the results of different executive orders are the same. People in companies are having them, but I’m also having them in my own home. I’m having them with my wife. I’m having them with my kids. I’m having them with the youth that I mentor that are asking, you know, various sincere questions. So for me, it’s not just about your organization that you may or may not jump and leave and you know, bounce back and forth from. But what does that mean for your local community in which you are grounded? What does that mean for your own family and for your kids? Like what are you going to—what is the example of what it means to operate with integrity during a crisis? What are you showing this next generation? And I think that’s what has helped me kind of stay really vigilant and not being swayed and not being pulled into fear, but really consistently re-grounding myself in the values and the frameworks that I have, and really utilizing them to kind of help people process what’s going on. So that’s where I’m at in this stage of the game.
Felicia Scott: I’m taking care of my “KID.” And “KID,” the “K” is for kindness. I think there is a lot of meanness to the way things are being executed and done. And there’s also a lot of meanness—on both sides of the aisle as they like to say—there’s a lot of meanness in the way that we deal with each other. And I think social media has made that a lot more easier to do, to just be unkind. And so I’m trying to be a kinder person. I think we need to just be kinder to each other, regardless of our differences. The “I” is integrity. MLK said, “The time is always right to do what is right.” That’s it. The time is always right to do what is right. And I think we have to—it’s been nice on mugs and t-shirts, but it’s critical now. And so do what’s right. And then finally, I think it’s about “Discipline.” The church I used to go to, the pastor used to say, “There’s the pain of discipline or the pain of regret.” Pain is inevitable. But will you suffer the pain of discipline, which in the end works out for your good and it works out for the better? Or will it be the pain of regret? And I think organizations, companies, corporations need to ask themselves that question. “Are we going to do what is right and be disciplined? Or are we going to ‘end the end’ five years down the line—maybe not even be here. And then regret the decisions or lack of decisions that we made at a crucial point in not just U.S. history, but world history as well?”
Oana Amaria: I love that we’re ending on that drive-by wisdom, even with a nice little acronym to help us remember. Hope you enjoyed this podcast. Thank you for spending a little bit of time with us. We hope to do these more often. And if you’re interested in some of the resources that we talk about, check out our website and we’ll see you on the next one. Thank you!
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